your states licensing requirements

[anthonyk]

Originally Posted by wildchild

for those who want tiered, why? do you think my 1600cc harley is faster or harder to control then a 600cc sportbike? people need to accept personal responsibility for what they drive. licensing only ensures you have a very basic understanding of the controls of a vehicle of one style or another. if you can understand the controls of a 250 rebel you can also drive a triumph rocket. doesn't mean you can handle it in any emergency situation but you can control it.

You haven't watched many brand-newbies on a bike, I'm guessing. They come up with all kinds of crazy ways to screw up controlling a bike, even after understanding the basic operation of the controls. A tiered system would hopefully keep people on something a little more forgiving until actually controlling the bike becomes second nature (and then they can start paying attention to what's around them).

Tiered licensing doesn't have to be a straight cc limit. Limiting horsepower is probably a smarter idea.

I dunno if the mandatory MSF is a good idea or not. I haven't seen any convincing studies that show the class does any long-term good.

[BobTheBiker]

Originally Posted by anthonyk

You haven't watched many brand-newbies on a bike, I'm guessing. They come up with all kinds of crazy ways to screw up controlling a bike, even after understanding the basic operation of the controls. A tiered system would hopefully keep people on something a little more forgiving until actually controlling the bike becomes second nature (and then they can start paying attention to what's around them).

Tiered licensing doesn't have to be a straight cc limit. Limiting horsepower is probably a smarter idea.

PRECISELY what I mean. although there should be SOME CC limit. newbies buying 1000cc superbikes as their first machine shouldnt be able to do so. far too much power for too little experience. let them build up experience on smaller bikes first to get familiar with controlling it THEN let them move up incremntally.

limiting how much power a newbie can have in their bike helps them focus more on learning to RIDE it than to just go fast in straight lines.

[RACER X]

Originally Posted by anthonyk

I dunno if the mandatory MSF is a good idea or not. I haven't seen any convincing studies that show the class does any long-term good.

i've seen a report from england (yes it's not the US, but better then nothing) that said 90+ % of motorcycle deaths were people that had no formal training.

thats a HUGE number.....

[neebelung]

Originally Posted by wildchild

msf is a useful tool is someone doesn't have another way to learn to ride BUT a few days of class and less then 10 miles of range time to get a license will not make you a better rider.

Just to clarify:

The MSF is the Motorcycle Safety Foundation. The CLASS you take is called (at least here in FL) the BRC - BASIC Riders Course. Emphasis on BASIC. It doesn't pretend to teach you everything you need to know, it's intended as an introductory course to give you the basic knowledge needed to operate a motorcycle. And when you finish the course, they literally tell you 'Congratulations! You're now qualfied to ride a motorcycle around a parking lot!'

That said, it's more training than most people would get otherwise. Having your brother's father's uncle's friend let you take their bike up and down the street a few times doesn't really constitute much in the way of "learning" how to ride. But having some basic skills, and then PRACTICING them (on your own, or with a skilled rider) both in a controlled environment (like a parking lot) and then on the street will go a long way.

Originally Posted by anthonyk

A tiered system would hopefully keep people on something a little more forgiving until actually controlling the bike becomes second nature (and then they can start paying attention to what's around them).

Tiered licensing doesn't have to be a straight cc limit. Limiting horsepower is probably a smarter idea.

I couldn't agree more.

[Ducati Diva]

NC You can get a learners by taking a written test, to get full license if you take MSF and pass no driving test but written test a must, no MSF take driving test and written test

[karl_1052]

When I took my test in 1988, The guy watched me drive around a parking lot setup to simulate a road situation.
He was probably 100 yards away when I was furthest from him.

The OSC(Ottawa Safety Council) test is much harder(our current test is written only, I believe), and they have been granted the power to award passing eqivilency tests for licences(you still have to do the paperwork at the MOT).

[Tmall]

Originally Posted by RACER X

ok, but is a state test gonna be harder or easier then a motorcycle specific test.

down here, i've heard of people having to make 4 stop & turns and the state test is done? is that sufficient enough?

MSF, your tested on braking, cornering, swerving, bike control.......


i'm pretty sure we call agree it should be harder, but it is what it is.

MSF test and our local test are the same.. ( We have Nova Scotia Safety Council not MSF. But, they use MSF materials.) Well, the harder parts anyway. Figure 8's and circles. I don't think you do the avoidance part..

[Tmall]

Originally Posted by RACER X

i've seen a report from england (yes it's not the US, but better then nothing) that said 90+ % of motorcycle deaths were people that had no formal training.

thats a HUGE number.....

But, what's the percentage of formally trained riders? If it's 95% who aren't formally trained, then they're coming out ahead.

[RACER X]

Originally Posted by Tmall

But, what's the percentage of formally trained riders? If it's 95% who aren't formally trained, then they're coming out ahead.

thats the prob. nobody really knows how many people actually ride licensed or not.

[marko138]

I think the MSF should be required. It's better than zero training. But it's not perfect. I had 2 people in class crash and they both passed.

It's not required in PA....but it is FREE.