Pharmacist Shoots Robber 5 Times - Charged with 1st Deg. Murder

[askmrjesus]

Originally Posted by Rider

You ever watch horror movies? You never stop until you're absolutely certain your target is D-E-A-D.

There's a slight difference between a wounded (and apparently unarmed) teenager laying on the floor, and Freddy Kruger.

Let's say a 250lb dude is out riding his bike, and gets pulled over for speeding. He gives the 175lb cop some lip, so the cop tasers his ass. The cop, who stills considers the bigger dude a threat, pops five rounds into the guy while he's laying on the ground. Still cool?

JC

[Rider]

Originally Posted by askmrjesus

There's a slight difference between a wounded (and apparently unarmed) teenager laying on the floor, and Freddy Kruger.

Let's say a 250lb dude is out riding his bike, and gets pulled over for speeding. He gives the 175lb cop some lip, so the cop tasers his ass. The cop, who stills considers the bigger dude a threat, pops five rounds into the guy while he's laying on the ground. Still cool?

JC

Yes. Don't lip off to a man carrying a gun.

[Particle Man]

Originally Posted by askmrjesus

There's a slight difference between a wounded (and apparently unarmed) teenager laying on the floor, and Freddy Kruger.

Let's say a 250lb dude is out riding his bike, and gets pulled over for speeding. He gives the 175lb cop some lip, so the cop tasers his ass. The cop, who stills considers the bigger dude a threat, pops five rounds into the guy while he's laying on the ground. Still cool?

JC

that depends - is said dude wearing flip-flops and shorts?

[Papa_Complex]

Originally Posted by Particle Man

that depends - is said dude wearing flip-flops and shorts?

... and does he have a BULLET IN HIS HEAD ALREADY?

[askmrjesus]

Originally Posted by Particle Man

that depends - is said dude wearing flip-flops and shorts?

Hey, it was hot out, and the dude's got a glandular problem.

Don't be a hater.

JC

[the chi]

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

... and does he have a BULLET IN HIS HEAD ALREADY?

For arguments sake:

This doesnt automatically mean he was not a threat. I just took my concealed weapons class, and the instructor clearly stated that if you feel threatened or in fear of your life, you basically keep shooting till they stop moving. (He wasnt advocating shooting people btw, simply telling us, if you pull that gun out, it better be a damned good reason and you better mean to use it, like LEO's are taught.)

Just because he had a bullet in his head doesnt mean he wasnt a threat...look at people who get shot, keep going, and never even have the bullet removed?

*edit to add*

Another thing to keep in mind, is everyone responds to pain etc differently. We recently lost 2 sheriffs locally, they tased the suspect, and while he was still laying on the ground he began firing and didnt stop till they were both dead.

[Papa_Complex]

Originally Posted by The Chi

For arguments sake:

This doesnt automatically mean he was not a threat. I just took my concealed weapons class, and the instructor clearly stated that if you feel threatened or in fear of your life, you basically keep shooting till they stop moving. (He wasnt advocating shooting people btw, simply telling us, if you pull that gun out, it better be a damned good reason and you better mean to use it, like LEO's are taught.)

Just because he had a bullet in his head doesnt mean he wasnt a threat...look at people who get shot, keep going, and never even have the bullet removed?

*edit to add*

Another thing to keep in mind, is everyone responds to pain etc differently. We recently lost 2 sheriffs locally, they tased the suspect, and while he was still laying on the ground he began firing and didnt stop till they were both dead.

No, of course4 it doesn't and the advice that you got to keep pulling the trigger until the target stops moving is the same that I've gotten from police. The fact that he was laying on the ground and had a bullet in his head, and didn't interfere when the proprietor walked over to retrieve another weapon with which to pump him full of bullets does strongly hint at the fact that he was no longer a threat though.

Ultimately this will hopefully all be sorted out in court. I supported Bernie Goetz until it came out that he had come back to one of the men he had shot, said "It looks like you could use another" or some such, then shot him again while he was laying on the floor with a bullet in his spine.

[the chi]

Its definitely a tough one.

I see exactly where you are coming from and tend to agree that he didnt "appear" to be much of a threat at that point.

Then again, I am all for the dude who shot him, protecting his life, those of his fellow workers and well, the kid knew what he was doing, and from that side of the fence, I kinda am of the opinion he just committed assisted suicide. What he did was wrong, and well, he is responsible for the mess in the first place. Its not like the pharmacist went vigilante and hunted for someone to shoot and kill.

[Rider]

Originally Posted by The Chi

Its definitely a tough one.

I see exactly where you are coming from and tend to agree that he didnt "appear" to be much of a threat at that point.

Then again, I am all for the dude who shot him, protecting his life, those of his fellow workers and well, the kid knew what he was doing, and from that side of the fence, I kinda am of the opinion he just committed assisted suicide. What he did was wrong, and well, he is responsible for the mess in the first place. Its not like the pharmacist went vigilante and hunted for someone to shoot and kill.

Exactly. That thief was laying on the ground. You don't know whether he is going to get up or just lay there. Might as well be on the safe side.

How many times you hear about these shooting sprees and people are staying alive by pretending they were dead. I say the only way to know for sure is to put as many bullets in them until you are certain they aren't getting up or you run out of ammo.

[askmrjesus]

Originally Posted by The Chi

For arguments sake:

This doesnt automatically mean he was not a threat. I just took my concealed weapons class, and the instructor clearly stated that if you feel threatened or in fear of your life, you basically keep shooting till they stop moving. (He wasnt advocating shooting people btw, simply telling us, if you pull that gun out, it better be a damned good reason and you better mean to use it, like LEO's are taught.)

The pharmacist's defense went out the window, as soon as he became the aggressor, and chased the other guy down the street. It's hard to claim fear for your life, if you're one doing the chasing.

As for head wound boy, is he was such a threat, he should have been shot BEFORE the pharmacist went all Charles Bronson, and ran out the door.

I'm not going to shed any tears for the kid. He choose an extremely limited career path, and got his ass shot for it. I put this under the, "Sucks to be you" heading. However, the pharmacist had control of the situation once the guy was down, and while I wouldn't necessarily call it Murder 1, I don't think he deserves an "atta-boy", and a pat on the head.

JC