want a 600cc SS bike for a first bike?

[anthonyk]

Yeah, I get that it's hard to prove anything, and that most newbie wrecks aren't caused by sheer horsepower or anything like that. But I'd wager most newbie crashes are caused by:

1) Bad control input, which is made worse on a supersport bike that does exactly what you tell it, and does it RIGHT NOW. Overbraking and locking the front or hitting a bump and whacking open the throttle are more serious on a less friendly bike.

2) Bad judgment, made worse by a bike that'll let you get over your head before you even know it.

I'm not on the side that says "all must start small or die" but I sure don't agree that anyone can start on any bike and be just fine, as long as they "respect the bike." I've seen that posted way too many times to count, and it's crap.

[Mr Lefty]

Originally Posted by anthonyk

Yeah, I get that it's hard to prove anything, and that most newbie wrecks aren't caused by sheer horsepower or anything like that. But I'd wager most newbie crashes are caused by:

1) Bad control input, which is made worse on a supersport bike that does exactly what you tell it, and does it RIGHT NOW. Overbraking and locking the front or hitting a bump and whacking open the throttle are more serious on a less friendly bike.

2) Bad judgment, made worse by a bike that'll let you get over your head before you even know it.

I'm not on the side that says "all must start small or die" but I sure don't agree that anyone can start on any bike and be just fine, as long as they "respect the bike." I've seen that posted way too many times to count, and it's crap.

I agree completely! respect has nothing to do with how you'll react when your in that OH SHIT moment.

[ceo012384]

Originally Posted by anthonyk

I sure don't agree that anyone can start on any bike and be just fine, as long as they "respect the bike."

Yeah that one cracks me up... I don't care what bike you're riding, ninja 250 or busa.... you don't need to 'respect' it, you need to know how to properly handle it.

You can respect the bike for all 300 feet of pavement your face is sliding on, doesn't matter.

[Homeslice]

I like how the author of the original article never even really owned a 600 before writing an essay about 600's and how they're not for beginners.......he just sold his 250 and is "currently shopping for" a 600/1000, and is "building" an old FZR-600 racebike in his garage.

His points are valid, but maybe a more credible source would be warranted.

[Rsv1000R]

Originally Posted by ceo012384

How do most newbies crash?

It's coming into a turn a little quicker than they're comfortable with and panicking, it's target fixation and running wide, it's have a stiff upper body and tucking the front, it's panic braking and locking up either tire, etc etc etc.

They are input/technique/mental errors that would occur on any bike.

True, but a 250 ninja is going to be giving lots more feedback to the rider that he's going fast at 70 mph than a 600SS will. That's what makes them safer.

[umairhashmi]

I love ninja 250s. I can sell them to a newbie and make my cut from the sale and usually they are back within a couple of months to buy a 600 and then i can make my cut AGAIN from the same person. How could i not love a bike that repeatedly puts money in my pocket. Although customer satisfaction is a different story...

[101lifts2]

Originally Posted by umairhashmi

I love ninja 250s. I can sell them to a newbie and make my cut from the sale and usually they are back within a couple of months to buy a 600 and then i can make my cut AGAIN from the same person. How could i not love a bike that repeatedly puts money in my pocket. Although customer satisfaction is a different story...

Sell them a 1000 first...then after they wad it up, you can tell them that they prolly should have started on a 600. This way you make more$$$ then putting a 250 in their hands first.

You can thank me later...lol

[umairhashmi]

Originally Posted by 101lifts2

Sell them a 1000 first...then after they wad it up, you can tell them that they prolly should have started on a 600. This way you make more$$$ then putting a 250 in their hands first.

You can thank me later...lol

I try to avoid that but most kids who walk in looking for a 1k,busa or zx14 have already made up their minds so they dont listen so i just end up giving it to them. I think its a great way of controlling the overpopulation crisis

[OreoGaborio]

Originally Posted by umairhashmi

I try to avoid that but most kids who walk in looking for a 1k,busa or zx14 have already made up their minds so they dont listen so i just end up giving it to them. I think its a great way of controlling the overpopulation crisis

Ya gotta explain it in terms they'll understand, like HP to Weight ratio. (most people know that kinda stuff from drag racing and if they don't it's an easy enough concept for them to grasp w/ a little explanation.)

Ask them to name a really fast car.... Typically they'll name a car that weighs probably 2500 lbs and has about 500 hp or so..... If they don't pick something that sounds like that, pick a car for them that does :P

Then tell em that car, at 500hp and 2500lbs has roughly 5lbs per hp....

Then tell em that your average literbike puts out almost 200hp (at the crank.... makes more of an impact than RWHP) & weighs about 400lbs (without them on it, but don't tell them that ) which translates to only 2lbs per hp... More than twice as much hp per pound than their supercar and probably 10 times as difficult to control since it takes a completely different set of skills to operate.

Does that sound like something that's safe to learn on?

That usually puts things in perspective for them and it worked like a charm for me this past weekend when I had a kid in my MSF class tell me he wanted a CBR1k.... he's now looking at older used 600's or 650 twins.

The next day he said he walked into a dealership & the salesman tried talking him into a ZX14 even after he told him it would be his first bike... he said he won't be going back there anytime soon.

[umairhashmi]

Originally Posted by OreoGaborio

the salesman tried talking him into a ZX14 even after he told him it would be his first bike... he said he won't be going back there anytime soon.

I think the Zx14 was on the manufacturer's "Hit List" for the month. Thats an extra $250 bucks on top of your regular commission so i can see why the salesman tried that which is understandable from a business perspective but i wouldnt do it. But then again i dont make a lot of money either so maybe i should start doing the same thing or start looking for a new job